Straight Talk On Immigration
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Immigration entry stamp on the inside page of a passport.
SAN DIEGO — Republican elected officials could use coaching on how to talk about the immigration issue — and, just as importantly, how not to talk about it.
There’s a huge need. When talking about immigration, some Republicans deserve encouragement. Some deserve scoldings. And some deserve a trip to the woodshed.
The folks in the last camp don’t realize that every time they talk about immigration, they succeed in repelling Latino voters and send them into the waiting arms of Democrats, who generally proceed to neglect or manipulate them.
It’s terrible for everyone. Republicans antagonize a constituency that, because of its conservative values, might otherwise be in play. Democrats become complacent and lazy because all they have to do to win the Latino vote is advertise the fact that they’re not Republicans. And Latinos, despite being one of the fastest growing segments of the electorate, remain marginalized.
Instead of trying to repair the breach with Latinos, many Republicans take the easy way out and deny that there is one. They tell themselves there is nothing they can do short of turning themselves inside out and embracing the idea of an open border. Since they’re not willing to do that, they do nothing. Some might suggest the problem is one of communication, insisting that they’re not getting the message out and that’s why their Latino outreach efforts aren’t bearing fruit.
Wrong, wrong, wrong. Republicans don’t have to open the border; they only have to open their minds. They don’t have to condone or reward illegal activity, or abandon the idea that the United States has, like any other country, the right to enforce its borders and protect its sovereignty. And they don’t have to throw up their hands and accept the fact that the United States is home to millions of illegal immigrants and there is little anyone can do about it. They just have to be careful that they don’t come across as anti-Latino.
As for the message not getting out, Republicans needn’t worry. It’s getting out all right. The problem is, it’s a bad message. Many conservatives seem to think that the immigration system is broken because we’re taking in an inferior class of people. They think illegal immigrants are invading the country, that they’re not assimilating, that they’re devouring benefits, that they’re committing crimes and bringing down our standard of living.
The message to Latinos from some elements of the GOP couldn’t be clearer: “We don’t like you. We don’t value you. We don’t respect you. Now, go and vote Republican.”
The GOP has a lot to learn — about Latinos, and about immigration. Republicans need to learn to criticize illegal immigration without attacking or demonizing the immigrants themselves. They need to learn to come down hard on any GOP elected official who so much as flirts with nativist or racist rhetoric. And they need to break with a tradition in this country that goes back more than 230 years and stop thinking of immigrants as inferior to previous waves.
If Republicans want to talk about immigration, they had better do it in the right way. They could stress the need for secure borders and argue that, in the post-9/11 era, it would be foolhardy to take a lax approach to those who are coming into this country. They could talk about personal responsibility and how every immigrant who enters the United States has an obligation to do so legally or, if they’re already in this country illegally and plan to stay, to do whatever they can to get right with the law. They could pound away on the concept of law and order and explain how rules have to be followed. And they could appeal to the notion of fairness and insist that ignoring or condoning the infraction of those who came illegally dishonors the memory of those who came legally.
I imagine that most Latinos wouldn’t mind this narrative. It’s high-minded and race-neutral. And they wouldn’t be cast as villains.
When Republicans talk about immigration, they don’t have to surrender their principles or be something they’re not. They just have to mind their manners and, for their own survival in a country that is becoming more Latino by the day, stop alienating people who might otherwise join the party.
Why do Latinos need to care if the GOP values their vote? Immigration is a dead issue. The fact that people this immigration is a civil rights issue is comical. People who break the law should not be rewarded. No side cares about the issue because American do not want immigrants here. Only business owners who want to pay illigals 5 dollars an hours care for them. How can we as Americans respect a group that breaks the law, then asks for the same rights as tax paying Americans? When African Americans break the law we lock them up and throw away the key. A crime is a crime. If you can get locked up for stealing a snickers, you can go to jail for crossing the boarder illigally. Become a citizen the right way then come talk to me.
James ilegal is ilegal what are you waiting for? start packing son.
Your argument is flawed because illegal immigrants are in the vast majority of cases not making 5 dollars an hour. Some in construction are making many times that amount.
The issue of immigration is not a dead issue simply because there are millions of illegal immigrants and it’s logistically impossible to remove them all. The issue is ignored because it’s a hard one to handle.
One important point in this article is that many politicians paint this issue black and white, when it is not. Blanket amnesty is not realistic, but I don’t think anybody is asking for that. But we should strive to find a rational solution between that and the current state of affairs, which is also ridiculous.
•James makes many statements – his argument is not flawed, he threw out a number that migrant workers make – he can’t take the time to write down every single wage that exists.
•The point is this, Business Owners Take Advantage. Not all, but many.
•Another Valid Point: A crime is a crime. The justice system that makes this country great and safe (for the most part) is the same that must be honored even in this difficult situation.
The problem here is that Mr. Navarette is much far too simplistic and condescending in his take on things. First of all, to equate the differences on immigration issues as a wholesale, “we don’t want you here” is a huge jump and is inaccurate. Many Americans, including the vast majority of legal Latinos, including myself, want to follow the rule of law along with humane and just treatment. Most Latinos I know who are legal want people to go through the process correctly just as they did.
Mr. Navarette is a simplistic writer who prides himself on trying to get people to react to his writing. He has publicly said that his purpose in his writing is to “piss people off” which I find denigrating. Mr. Navarette is not a discerning thinker and it is unfortunate that people of his ilk have risen to the foreground as “Latino experts” which he is not. He is an opportunistic journalist who does not speak for many of us serious-thinking Latinos. According to this article, here’s his take about us if we don’t follow his rules, “We don’t like you, we don’t want you, we don’t respect you.” “We should be taken out to the woodshed.” Please, he needs to show some respect to the foundations and traditions of this great country, as he in his awkward way, seems to be asking us to respect Latinos. Latinos who have done it the right way are well-respected by most Anglos, at least that has been my experience and that of most law-abiding, God-honoring, hard-working Latinos I know. Is there prejudice, sure but there is everywhere about all kinds of things. People just don’t like feeling like they are losing the rule of law in their country. I highly respect many Hispanics and I don’t dislike the illegal immigrants, I simply don’t want our country to continue this policy of allowing the rule of law to disintegrate before our very eyes. That is what has happened in so many of our countries and look at the results. It is dangerous to all of us, yes Latinos included. I ask that Latinos get past the emotion, which I understand, and begin to think about the overall good of this country.
This piece is drivel and over the top. With all due respect, I am disappointed that The Americano has chosen to associate with Mr. Navarette. I would be quite surprised if former Speaker Gingrich would be even close in his views to this piece. By the way, the country is not “becoming more Latino” as Mr. Navarette purports, more and more Latinos are embracing the American way of life, liberty and justice for all and personally I welcome those who do. I certainly do not want to become “more Latino” if that means importing the social and political injustices that seem to haunt almost all our Latin American countries. No, he is wrong, people of Latino origins are embracing the American dream and the more of us that do, the better for all of us and for our country. Peace.
Exactimente’ Daniel Rojas! Amen.
It’s all about Hispanics/Latinos of conservatism.
Let me guess you got your share of the pie everyone else must be deported.
Hector,
So, if you are asking if I got “my share of the pie” by getting an education, working hard and following the rule of law then I am proud to say, “yes.” What’s amazing to me is that you imply that somehow this is to be denigrated?
Also, I never said, nor do I think everyone who is here is deported. That is not even possible and it is a ridiculous article. Those who are here should be given a path to citizenship over time and by following agreed-upon conditions. In other words, they should be given the opportunity that they will now follow the law but the rule of law does need to be re-established. In relationship to that action, the border should be controlled so that we are not dealing with this type of unfortunate situation (for everyone involved) again.
Please do not denigrate people who have done things the right way due to your emotion and lack of critical thinking skills.
I’m trying to understand your position. What does it mean to have laws that limit immigration and make it illegal to immigrate without permission if doing just that results in awarding legal status? Why would anyone wanting to immigrate who couldn’t get permission just not come illegally under those circumstances? It seem to me you are inviting illegal immigration. Please explain why that assumption is wrong.
There are a few things in this article that can’t be argued against. The reality of it is that comments from Republicans on this issue end up driving Hispanics away from the party. That is true. Not all of them, but enough. And that’s just ridiculous when you consider Republican principles align more closely with most Hispanics.
Looking at illegal immigration as the disintegration of the rule of law is precisely seeing this issue in black and white. Are people breaking the law? Yes. But not the way it’s broken in many of our countries. People broke the law in this situation mostly to find work opportunities.
Those who have proven worthy, those who have risen to the occasion, those who have embraced the american way of life but are still illegally here, shouldn’t those get a shot? Don’t tell me they should “follow the legal path” because the problem is that they don’t have a legal path. It does not exist. That’s the truth.
The fact that we, as Hispanics (not all, but mostly) are emotionally involved in this issue should not be seen as a problem. It is precisely because we are emotionally involved that we can be the catalysts to bring about debate and change the current situation, which is not working out for anybody.
“Don’t tell me they should “follow the legal path” because the problem is that they don’t have a legal path. It does not exist. That’s the truth.”
But that’s implicit in any system that limits immigration, something that the citizens of this country want. And while the laws reflect that desire, the lack of effective enforcement of them make a mockery of it, massively magnified when the limited opportunities to immigrate are awarded on the basis of having violated those laws.
It is true that any system that limits immigration will have cases in which there really is no path. It is also true that laws are made to draw that line in the sand.
My argument is that the current system is too strict and is partly to blame for the current situation. The current line in the sand needs to be moved to allow for the needs of the United States.
Again, I’m not saying we need to erase the line in the sand. One MUST exist. What I’m saying is, again, that the issue is not black and white. We need to find a logical solution to the problem, because saying “Illegal, Illegal, sent them all back, send them all back” is not going to work.
More so, there is a difference between those immigrants who are worthy of a chance and those who are here to make trouble. We need to create a process to keep complete control and make sure we are weeding out the bad ones. But we should not throw the baby with the bath water either.
It’s fine to argue that the laws are wrong. It’s totally another thing to enable, support or reward disregarding it. I’m not sure what you mean by “needs.” What are these? I understand that people have “wants” in that regard: bargain employees, increasing the value of capital, ethnic political power, Democratic Party power, etc. Those are different from needs.
I don’t see what wrong with sending people back who are in the country illegally. That and removing the current existing incentives to being in the country illegally seems perfectly reasonable and necessary to control illegal immigration, something perhaps you don’t really want.
There are literally billions of people in the world who are “worthy of a chance” to immigrate to U.S. Yet you seem think those who have broken the law by being here should have preference over them. I imagine it would be easy to fill 12 million with those who haven’t violated any immigration laws of this country with all the “penalties” being envision in the amnesties being proposed for current illegal immigrants. In fact I’m quite sure we could auction them off, with payments to be made when those immigrants begin working in this country. That would be a good demonstration of the value of what are actually rewards some support giving illegal immigrants for their illegality.
Great comment and I agree 100% with all of it! Peace
Great comment Daniel Rojas! That is who I meant the compliment to. Thank you and Peace
Daniel, I too was dissapointed with this article. I read because I want to make intelligent decisions regarding a matter, I read to discover facts I have not yet known, so that when I write I educate and inform. This article was a waste of my time. It stated a few obvious notions, that is all. Dissapointing.
PS, Do you write? Are you Twitter or Facebook? Buscame. I want to network with people of like-mind.
Freedom is not a right that you are born with. You have to earn the right to be an American. Go through the process, wait in line and become a true American, so you don’t have to waste Obamas time. Obama can worry about true Americans that pay their taxes and are not leaching off our economy. Taxes pay for school, military, street lights ect….. Everything that illigals use but do not contribute to. Earn your freedom.
Actually, freedom is a right you’re born with. It’s not something exclusive to the American experience. Lemme ask you all a question: do you expect me to believe you’re Latino just because you place a Hispanic last name on your profile? Some of your comments are racially insensitive and ignorant. Second of all, most illegal immigrants DO pay taxes. That is why Allan Greenspan, Ronald Reagan and both Bush Sr. and Jr. believed in reating a path to citizenship for illegal immigrants. They all pay sales taxes, property taxes (renters’ fees go to property taxes, in case you couldn’t deduce that), payroll taxes (why do you think they need all those fake SS cards, to get credit cards?). Not only that, they don’t get tax returns and don’t use basic services at the level most Americans do. In other words, they put in more than they get out. The Texas State Comptroller found that out–and she was a Republican. If Republicans truly want my vote (trust me, it’s there for the taking, Obama has been a failure to Latinos), they’ll end the post-Reagan xenaphobic talk and realize the illegal immigrants are not the enemy, they are the foundation of many of the things we Americans enjoy everyday. BTW, I don’t have a Hispanic-sounding last name.
Bob: Let me ask you a question. Are you one of those “I’m the smartest guy in the room – just ask me” kind of guys?
Another question: Is my being (and you’ll have to take my word for it) Hispanic, Conservative and American make me racist, xenaphobic, or somehow insignificant and irrelevant to your apparent intellectual superiority?
Bob. I don’t know your ethnicity, but your own commentary reads with a twang of racism against Conservative American Hispanics and a heavy dose misplaced compassion. You do believe there to be such persons as Conservative Hispanics, don’t you Bob?
CIS Estimates DREAM Act Would Cost American Taxpayers $6.2 Billion Per Year
The Center for Immigration Studies says passage of the DREAM Act would cost American taxpayers at least $6.2 billion per year. According to CIS, at least 1.2 million illegal aliens would enroll in public colleges and universities, qualifying for in-state tuition rates. Show More The Center for Immigration Studies says passage of the DREAM Act would cost American taxpayers at least $6.2 billion per year. According to CIS, at least 1.2 million illegal aliens would enroll in public colleges and universities, qualifying for in-state tuition rates. The average $6,000 in-state tuition benefit would be subsidized by the taxpayers. “These institutions where most of these kids can be expected to enroll are in dire straits,” said Steven Camarota, Director of Research at CIS. “Right now it’s an unfunded mandate that would come at the expense of not just taxpayers but kids trying to get into these schools.” Camarota said that the DREAM Act in its current form could crowd out current U.S. citizens because of the funding issue.
Moron.
I am not a Mexicain but I do believe I know how Mexicains think because I have family there and I’ve been there many times. When it comes to rules and regualtions lets just say Mexicains are very relaxed. Mexicains see us as uptight because we have too many rules. This is one reason why Mexicains come across ilegally. They come from a culture that takes a more laissez faire attitude towards life.
We need to let mexcains know this is not Mexico. Here you must follow the rule of law. If we don’t do that we will end up just like Mexico.
This is why you need togo back where ever you came from, your comments are not based on facts please get an education spelling and gramma is terrible.
It’s not Mexicains, it Mexicans.
Your comments do ring true, but I have a slightly different take. I do believe the culture in Mexico and other latin american countries is such that there isn’t as strong a respect for the rule of law. Most people who grow up under that culture will end up having a relaxed view when it comes to following the law.
However, I do believe the respect for the rule of law in the United States is a trait that is admired by many in latin america.
Beyond the illegal crossing of the border, a vast majority of immigrants do end up embracing the American culture for the rule of law. More so subsequent generations, because they grew up under that culture.
jeffersonradical@yahoo.com
FROM A JEFFERSON RADICAL
CONPREHENCIVE POLOCY ON BORDER SECURITY
To address border security we must address the invaders that already have occupied your country. Their presence cannot be disputed and all that enter the United States without putting themselves under the jurisdiction of the United States must be considered invaders and illegal combatants for the safety and sovereignty of the United States and the citizens. Many of the invaders have no intent of harm but are invaders just the same. They have little understanding of rule of law coming here in large part from environments of outlaws by way of outlaws and living here as outlaws. Even as outlaws many have become productive in there lives living in the United States. Their presence must be under the jurisdiction of the United States and the administration of their presence must be paid for by the outlaws themselves by a personal tax for each to pay their way to citizenship. Each outlaw would be given legal status as a provisional permanent resident (PPR) if they apply for residents, show means of support, and there is no adverse past actions to disqualify them. Their path to citizenship would have the same criteria as any other resident after they applied for residents wile living in the United States the (PPR) would according to length of time in the United States would be considered permanent residents by the State Department at a rate of one for every ten from their country of origin that is authorized for residents in State Department’s course business. This is the only fair way to provide for (PPR) and those that play by the rules which are the more desirable in the first place.
This leaves the foreign invaders that do not register they must be considered illegal combatants and not under the Posse Comitatus Act of 1878 for the safety of all of us. We can not afford to put yourselves in the position of too little too late with the study increase in violence from cartels and human smugglers. The opportunity of being proactive is coming to an end fast with increased violence over the border and the Mexican governments unwillingness or inability to control it. This can be done by executive order leaving (PPR) to the congress to act to provide the (PPR) status exemption. With the cooperation of the executive branch speed would be needed as soon as possible to prevent their detainment and deportation. This would also eliminate the problem of anchor babies because if the parent is not under the jurisdiction of the United States their children are not entitled to citizenship.
The border the length of the Rio Grand should be protected by the Coast Guard men and equipment with fire power and agility to engage invaders as long as they are not lost sight of for an extended length of time. Ducking into a building or other cover would not be a reason to disengage on either side of the border. Something in 40mm to 60mm range on boats and amphibious armored personnel carriers would be appropriate. With helicopters with added fire power as back up. The same type of defensive ability on the rest of the border would be the type of deterrent needed to discourage drug traffickers and other invaders. Making the assumption valid that illegally crossing the border could have only aggression as their intentions with this as the intended message.
The need for temporary worker would be filled by each State’s needs though the unemployment office as the employer needs are unable to be filled. A tracking device would be paid for by the temporary workers. This would be much cheaper than what is paid to coyotes and could be deducted from several pay checks. In addition return passage must be provided before entering as a temporary worker. If the tracking device is removed it would be assumed that they mean to act as terrorists and be treated as illegal combatants. Anyone helping them knowing there status would also be treated the same as aiding any other terrorist.
This is the problem, everyone thinks they know how the Chicano people think. That’s just plain racist. We all think the same right? No, We are all diverse and have many different view points. Shame on you.
This website it’s only what we would say in castellan “chupa medias” (google it). They don’t care about Latinos, they care about Latino vote.
Once again, republicans underestimate, build stereotype, and assume they can figure out how people from many different countries and cultures think.
Once again, thanks for thinking your are better than a certain group of people and that we will not be able to see what you are trying to do with this insulting website.
Verguenza deben sentir los Hispanos que se solidarizan con el “PD”, los valores e intereses de ese partido no tienen nada que ver con los valores Latinos..
Liberales, anticristianos, pro-gay etc, etc, etc..
Hasta donde yo he aprendido nosotros los hispanos venimos de paises donde nos inculcaron una muy fuerte fe religiosa, los matrimonios son entre un hombre y una mujer eso entre algunos otros issues……
Quizas los dirigentes del Partido Republicano no hayan caido en cuenta que quienes estan creando “aversion” hacia ellos y mas aun hacia el propio pueblo norteamericano, son los Medios de Difusion Hispanos, las cadenas de habla Hispana que constantemente tejiversan las realidad.
No tienen escrúpulos en decir frases como “sentimiento anti-hispano, anti-inmigrante, llamarle a los inmigrantes sin aclarar el 90 por ciento de las veces , con el fin de confundir a los incautos. Hay que recordar que una mentira repetida hasta el cansancio puede llegar a ser creible.
Por otro lado esos que como indica la propia palabra llegaron aqui de forma ilegal colándose por el traspatio no deben ser premiados con ningun tipo de legalización que no sea la de trabajadores temporarios si acaso.
No se puede acoger a todos los ciuadanos que quieran ingresar a este ni ningun pais ilegalmente, esto es comparable a un barco,si el capitan deja que se suba todo aquel que quiera el mismo se hundirá con todos adentro.
Necesita cualquier nación del mundo tener preparada un infraestructura acorde a la cantidad de personas que puede acoger, eso es un principio básico para la supervivencia civilizada.
Soy hispana y me honra decir que en los 22 años que he vivido aqui nunca me he sentido discriminada.
Lo que si me duele es ver como el partido que está en el poder ahora si subestima a la mayoria de mis conciudadanos.
Todos necesitamos “libertad individual” para poder crecer en todos los órdenes de nuestras vidas,
Reflexionen, para que puedan ver con claridad entre P. Demócrata o P. Republicano cual es el que verdaderamente tiene nuestros mismos valores.
Que lastima da que gente como usted piensa que los Republicanos es el partido al que los Hispanos deben de apoyar. La que no tiene verguenza y vive en una burbuja es usted los Hispanos son discriminados a diario gracias a la retorica antiimigrante del partido Republicano si usted cree que debemos deportar los ilegales agame un favor i regrese de donde vino hipocrata.
Disculpe, argumente su opinión, pues no dice nada.Plus, quisiera saber en que parte de mi intervención dije que hay que deportar a alguien….Ahhhh y no siga la retórica de los medios Hispanos “sentimiento anti-inmigrante”, piense debe ser “sentimiento anti-ilegales”.Recuerde este pais tiene cuotas P/ visas en casi todos los paises de la region, ordenadamente.
Nombre fecha y hora de los Republicanos que dice Ud. hacen uso de la retórica anti-inmigrante legal…
Ademas yo no me tengo que ir de aqui
pues estoy en orden, respeto todas las leyes y principalmente no me quejo de nada, estoy orgullosa de vivir aqui.
Gladys, yo no siento ninguna verguenza en solidarizarme con el partido demócrata, el único partido a cual que le importan los Latinos, y no solamente los votos Latinos.
Si tu crees que el partido GOP es el que te corresponde, anda. Anda a ver como te tratan. Llamame cuando te hagan Presidente.
Nosotros los immigrantes, los que trabajamos y sudamos aquí todos los días, tenemos en cuenta que la tolerancia, el respeto mutuo, y el deseo de mejorar las cosas para todos, y no solamente para los que ya tienen, son los principios del partido Democrata. Lo de los gays, el matrimonio, el anti-cristiano, son tramas que han sido y seran usados por el GOP para capturar a gente como tu.
Yo se cuando me estan jugando. Tu aun no lo sabes.
You could argue that caring about the Latino vote equates to caring about Latinos.
The reason I think this is a good thing is because I do gravitate towards the Republican party, but in the last few years some of the rhetoric has (right or wrong) seemed to be very anti Hispanic, so it makes me think I’m not wanted there.
Reaching out to us is a good first step. I’m glad this is happening because I think it’s a shame that Hispanics end up supporting the Democratic party for no good reason.
If nothing else, this appears to be an initial effort to reach out to people who, like me, feel Republican, but can’t get 100% behind the party because of a perceived rejection.
Of course, the proof is in the pudding!
Juan,
I think all of us Latinos need to face the fact that neither political party was drawn up to represent the Latino people effectively. They both have to “fit” us into a much bigger picture. We deceive ourselves if we think either party can cleanly do this. They can’t for anybody. The question for me is which is closer to my values. To me, the most important issues are education and economic development and on both of those counts I’m going with the Republicans. I think the Democrats serve their purpose as a counterweight but they are not strong on either education (slaves to the teacher’s unions) or on economic development (tax and spend). I think that many Republicans are genuinely concerned about Latinos. That’s what I see. For me, the Dems pretty much appease them as they think they already have their vote, but what did they do, for example, on immigration when they had FULL control of all branches of government. Nada, and that’s a fact.
ALL politicians are motivated by votes and that isn’t a Republican or Democrat thing. That is just the way it is. So, who cares what each politician’s motivation is (we already know!) if they are now coming out and actively supporting important Latino issues on education and economic development.
Ximena, I am sorry that you do not see that you just threw a blanket of stereotype over the Republicans in this nation. A very large group, encompassing many cultures and diverse types of people who think independently.
So….I’m not supposed to care about Latinos now because I am a Republican?
(albeit a poor one)
Well, I must not care…I am a Republican, and you said we don’t.
—>Do you see how this makes no sense at all? You criticized a group for being stereotypical and behaved in the very manner you chose to judge.<—
Preciosa, no estas pensando. You simply have a chip on your shoulder, and have chosen to judge an entire political party – unjustly.
~almita
You are right. Somos un numero. Just look at the introduction of this Website. They built it to get our attention and maybe some of our “increasing numbers”. Every election, no importa cual tipo they talk about the swing vote. We are manipulated by either party because we, WE, cannot unite. Immigration is a serious issue that should not be used to get our vote. I have family that is legal and illegal both bust their butts (Manual Labor of course) they follow the law, they are not dealing drugs or stealing. We need to unite to come up with a real solution to “our” problem. Things like “anchor babies” are hurtful as hell. How many of us would not fall under this umbrella of discrimination? I want my children to be proud of their heritage. What will I tell them when politicians on television talk about mexican as if they are scum, useless people. We (latinos) are not useless people, we deserve a whole lot more than we get.
Joe, indeed you are right. I have been researching about citizenship in other countries, and to become a citizen of another country is to deny your previous one. Forget about it completely. It is this concept that many are forgetting.
I am American born, Not all of my forefathers were. My father wasn’t, my mother’s father wasn’t, one side from Mexico, another from Canada. This beautiful combination is a part of all of us. Some of us have pure bloodlines, many do not.
What makes us American? Citizenship.
What does it mean to become a Citizen? To allow (voluntarily) the mantle that was previously ours to slip from our shoulders, as it were, and to put on a new one. An American one.
Do we deny our family? Our Blood? NO.
but they become secondary. We are Americans now and we are Americans First. When this takes place in the heart of immigrants, then we as a country will rise to greatness for we will be truly united once more. It is this unification that leads to success, and the fracturing of our nation’s identity is what will lead to our demise, for a house divided will not stand.
Written in love.
Almita: Absolutely and beautifully well put!
Perhaps you could:
Refer to this site as Norteamericano. People from south of the border already are Americanos.
Distance yourself from the racist-crazy elements of the Republican party who don’t care if you are “legal or illegal”. Only that your are white or not.
Neither Gingrich or Navarrette have never made a strong statement against these crazy people.
If you want credibility with people of color you need to show them that you find this racist element to be un-american and without any place in the Republican party. And you need to make that statement on a National platform, in front of the press, not just this newsletter.
Good luck with that.
Great comment and observation Denis. Mr Navarrette wrote an article recently supporting Sarah Palin. Im sure she will help him grab the Latino vote. lmao Mr Gingrich won’t publicly denounce any of his racist friends in the Republican Party and Mr Navarrette won’t either. Mr Navarrette is a thrill seeker and not a truth speaker. He’s an exploiter of the worst kind from what I have read through his articles.
It should be called Straight Talk about Nada! I agree with many people who commented before me. this is a fluff piece to continue to exploit Latinos and not help them. It helps Mr. Navarrette’s personal gain and in that I guess he seeks fame. If he seeks fame perhaps he should move to New York and join a dance company and leave those who really care about this issue to write about it and discuss it. How can he be serious or be taken seriously when his main goal first and foremost is to piss people off or offend? His argument is lost from the beginning because of his initial intent. I too am disappointed to see him on this site. Great job Americano you are showing your true colors. You don’t care about Latinos but you do care about making some famous like Mr. Navarrette.
Andale’ Miguel C. Amen twice. This article explains why Ruben gets a frequent invitation to Bill O’Reilly’s The Factor. Bill agrees with Ruben, Ruben agrees with Bill, and the interview becomes nothing more than a mutual pat on the back – “Straight Talk de nada” indeed.
Great comment Miguel. This site has changed
The problem with avoiding coming across as anti-Latino is that simply expecting that the laws against being in the country illegally be effectively enforced have been undermined by those that don’t accept that, Navarrette included, despite what he may claim. That inevitably leads to arguments that those violating the law, who are mostly Latino, must be proven (as if you could ever do so to the satisfaction of illegal immigration supporters) to be somehow bad persons or that their presence in the country leads to negative consequences in order for what is legal to prevail.
Navarrette writes that “Republicans don’t have to open the border, …don’t have to condone or reward illegal activity, ..that the United States has… the right to enforce its borders and protect its sovereignty.. don’t have accept the fact that the United States is home to millions of illegal immigrants and there is little anyone can do about it,” but his own writings belie that claim. As much as the citizens of the country might want immigration to be limited and legal, and by logical extension, illegal immigration be effectively controlled, that and the rule of law aren’t the controlling factor for those running our government, which effectively serves those that don’t want illegal immigration controlled.
It’s a shame that people feel the need to go beyond simply expecting that those in government uphold the laws of country and the wishes of the majority of citizens, but without the ability to hold citizens and elected officials of this country who promote illegal immigration accountable, given that the elites who control the mechanisms of such accountability are largely of this same ilk, we end up with nasty, if what should be unnecessary, debates.
I was a loyal reader of this site when it started but it’s not the same site anymore. The writers had passion and conviction. You could feel their emotions jump of the page. Perhaps I liked the site in the past because of the writers who were here or my obscure web friendship with ipastor. This site had potential to be a real voice for Latinos and to offer information and opinions. Now it’s an arm of the Republican Party to woo Latinos without regard to informing or educating. This is the biggest BS article I’ve ever read. It shared nothing, stated nothing and quite bluntly is a massive waste of time. Good luck Americano but you need to change back to your humble beginning and stop this butt kissing. The videos of people asking us to go to your forum. I don’t even know who the hell they are!
Monica Lopez: As you put it – “to woo Latinos without regard to informing or educating” – you nailed with respect to some of the contributing writers, editors and the posts at The Americano. Too often The Americano does tend to lean heavily on a centrist-moderate ideal at the ready to coax and aid the Republican Party to bend to the desires of the Democrat Left, at the cost of taking advantage of our vote.
To you Monica and the rest of our Conservative Hispanic-Latino brothers and sisters, I say stay ahead of our opposition by using this website, chime in often, and have them rely on us to inform and educate them. Likewise with the Republicans, the Democrats, Independents or any other Party out there. As we are already inclined, as it is built into our DNA to face challenges head on, we must have them to rely on us to inform and educate. If we remove ourselves from discussion because of a point of contention, then the written articles as this one will set the tone, the criteria and attitude of Hispanic-Latino Americans and their pursuit of a limited American dream. It’s articles and posts like these that should prompt us all to dispute and speak against that which we know is opposed to traditional Conservative principles. As to Newt Gingrich, the esteemed guests of honor, and those were fortunate enough to attend the D.C. Hispanic forum, let them have their cake, their speeches and pomp. For now, they speak and listen well unto themselves. Hispanic-Latino Conservatism is on the rise and when the 2012 campaigning begins, they will have to direct their attention to us. We will be informing and educating them.
No hay peor ciego que el que no quiere ver !!!!
Thanks Monica. I don’t know who those people in the videos are either but I guess they are our self appointed Latino leaders lmao!
For the record I was born and raised in tue United States. I have a Hispanic last name, but I am African decent. No group in Washington cares about immigration reform. If they did it would be complete. You can cry all you want, U.S. Citizens dont care either.
Hispanic leaders are all bark, no bite. They have yet to do anything that the have promised their own people. Maybe you guys should take notes from blacks an save yourselves and stop depending of the government for everything. Build your government in your own country then come talk to me.
If we opened the borders, America would look like TJ, Mexico. Look what Hispanics did to los Angeles. Socal is a shit hole now.
James: If your referring to the current Hispanic leadership whose ideology aligns in lock step with the current Democrat hard Left leadership touting a Liberal-Progressive banner, then I will agree with you. Indeed, a lot of noise with little action. It is after all the Left end of the political spectrum (with the ever reliable Republican compromises) that have created the appearance of Tijuana and Nogales within so many areas of L.A. and Phoenix. It has been their intent for the past (nearly) twenty five years to allow it, then expect us to embrace it and have us assimilate to it. The Left has created and nurtured the very environment that allows the foreign cultural change to exist and continue to grow without hinder.
To your point that we “should take notes from Blacks and save yourselves and stop depending on the government”: It is the Left that has created this dependency system with little hope for change in much of the Hispanic community as well as the Black community. What the current Black leadership of the Democrat Party has allowed to exist in Black American communities, that example is no vision of hope for our own salvation. It’s time for Conservatives within our own Hispanic American and Black American communities to step forward and begin the task of reversing this trend of having us accept the piecemeal gains as “Progressive” change for America. That kind of so called advancement for our own good has to come to a quick end before the entire country becomes (in your words) “a shit hole”.
I like most of the respondents here at this post, am of Hispanic descent, and an American citizen with every right to opine (or as you say “cry”) about the nearly inescapable government created circumstances that keeps so many of our mutual communities in a dependency state. The significance of our vote has now taken a new turn, and in the future, it is likely to be to an avoidance of the Left. That leaves only one direction to move to.
The jobless rate inched up in November to 9.8% after settling at 9.6% for the past several months. The jobless rate for most vulnerable groups of U.S. citizens and legal immigrants all increased in November. If passed by Congress, the DREAM Act Amnesty would add at least 2.1 million individuals to the depressed job market. The newest version of the DREAM Act (S.3992) introduced by Senator Dick Durbin allows for individuals who qualify for the DREAM Act to “engage in employment in the United States.” The Migration Policy Institute estimates that 2.1 million illegal aliens could qualify for the DREAM Act all of which would be eligible to obtain jobs
Thank you for actually educating a person on a matter.♥
The article above was a waste of my time. I am disappointed in it – it was accusatory. I have no tools to go and make a difference as a result of reading it. I am not more informed by reading it. It was useless. A waste of space and written in a self-important manner.
There are those in politics who use us for our vote. We know this, it is fact, you can’t hide from truth. They will take any vote they can get in order to advance themselves and their own agenda.
These parasites are in every party. Fact.
There are those who desire a country based on the Constitution, not a country that is based on a warped and twisted version of it. I am learning more and more about these men and women – they love America and the citizens therein, regardless of race. Most of them are in the conservative movement.
It is up to us to decide whom we trust and place in office, person by person, I never vote according to political offiliation, but by the person’s biography.
Having said all of that – immigration reform must be defined. I want a definition that means more than “change it”.
I have been reading on the act of amnesty that took place in 1986, under Reagan.
I plan to look at all angles and effects this legislation had on our country – and then use that knowledge to develop more informed views on the DREAM Act.
As for the chip on the shoulder attitude of “They don’t want us here”. It is definitely a reality among my family in TX.
The only thing is – it is the media that feeds it.
Not the Republican party.
Sorry Ruben. With due respect as a brother Chicano, it’s not convincing that this Navarrette narrative comes across as “Straight Talk”. Too much is omitted and I can’t help but believe that it was done so with purpose.
I disagree with your baited suggestion that Conservatives believe that “the immigration system is broken”. Are you including Conservative Hispanics within that reckless stroke of broad-brushing? Perhaps we need a more clear definition of what a Conservative Hispanic is and/or believes.
It is the central talking point of the Left that touts, laments and embraces a so called “broken” immigration policy as an excuse to allow illegal immigrants to remain in the U.S. as victims of America, without repercussions. Fuel is added to the fire by the antagonist Leftist media that plays right along with scripted talking points and badly scripted news reports as is provided (with suggested editing) by this current Democrat leadership. As if renovating, reforming and redefining the existing immigration laws will improve the relationship between what you deem as a national political party leaning toward racism and the very people that you want them to attract, you neglect the high value input from the Conservative Hispanic. It is a firm Conservative stance (leaving Repub’s out of the equation) that holds that immigration laws are intentionally not enforced for the sole purpose of giving it an appearance of a “broken system” in need of reforms, enter Amnesty, enter the DREAM Act. Regardless of each party’s insistence that the other bears fault for out of control illegal immigration, it is Liberal-Progressive controlled Democrats that are gaming and politicking the system by allowing millions of illegals into America without scrutiny, while the Repubs’ fall spineless to the fearful possibility of being labeled as racist. For the Republican act of saving face, compromise becomes a beautiful way to gracefully accept selling their souls to the less than angelic sects of feigned compassion.
You should know better than most Ruben, having spent a reasonable amount of time here in Phoenix pushing your pen for the Arizona Republic. Have you forgotten about the Phoenix suburb of Maryvale and the intended and unintentional consequences that we’ve been left with as a result of the conveniently called “broken immigration policy”. If you did not take note of the damage that was created in the wake of 25 years of illegal immigration, then that can be nothing less than an indication that you did not make it a point to leave your desk and burn some shoe leather with an on site-in our community-in the hood report and interview, to witness for yourself the absence of politicos addressing our quality of life issues. The only consistencies we’ve had for years have been the relentless story lines of victimized illegal immigrants without regard to those of us who have been here all our lives dealing with the daily burden of it This while the Arizona Republic tries to convince the wary readership that everything will somehow be under control if we’ll only embrace the Amnesty point of view. You may have written from your heart, but you did not do so from on site. Nor did you take the initiative to speak to Conservative Hispanics for a diverse cross section of real opinion.
Like the direction this Americano seems to be taking, we likewise need to prepare to distance ourselves from it if the landscape begins to look too familiar.
Not that you’d take advice Mr. Rubes’ from a blue collar construction guy, but you reveal much about yourself in the way you omit certain truths in your written word. You need to give us some credit. We can read between the lines.
Ruben Navarrette does not speak for me. As a conservative independent, I will vote for candidates that reflect my values, Republican or Democrat. In the last 50 years, the Democrats have totally abondoned my values. Do I trust Rebublicans? Not always, but there are individual Republicans I trust and their platform still gives me some hope.
i am a 57 year old white man who spent over 30 years doing farm work with latino migrant workers
i speak fluent spanish, but do not read it very well
so i speak from personal experience when i say that this country desperately needs common sense migrant labor policies- dealing with H2a was a nightmare
and every time my latino co-workers either ran afoul of the law or had to deal with the system, they got the short end of the stick- do not be fooled into thinking that the people behind this web site are not biased against the average latino- they will showcase the very few high achieving conservative latinos who have chosen a career in public service, and proudly take credit for his or her success- but they view the average working latino as a either a threat to be dealt with or a potential voter to fool into switching to their side
they have no idea what it really means to try and raise a family on a low wage job and paying high rent while living in a place where much of the population holds you in disdain
the fact of the matter is that their party is composed of mainly white americans who view America’s racial diversity as both a threat to their delusions of supremacy and as something to try and eliminate- anyone coming here from a spanish speaking country is expected to suddenly start speaking perfect english once they are here while at the same time thinking that and white american who speaks a few words of spanish is miraculous
many white americans reside in areas that were originally under spanish and mexican control and still have nearly all the original spanish town and city names- before the mexican-american war, their ancestors were the illegal aliens- allowed to settle mexico’s northern frontier in exchange for money paid to the local authorities- and when they decided they liked it- they started a war and simply took all the land- just look at a map of the southwest
after world war II, a mexican man could present at the border, pay six dollars, and enter the country- from there, he could travel anywhere in the entire country to find work, and could send for his family once he got settled- when the economy went bad, they were all told to go back to mexico
one negative effect of NAFTA was the destruction of the rural village economy in mexico because of the availability of cheap corn from the usa
now the only way to make money in a lot of places is to work for the drug cartels, or leave in search of a job
“they got the short end of the stick- do not be fooled into thinking that the people behind this web site are not biased against the average latino- they will showcase the very few high achieving conservative latinos who have chosen a career in public service, and proudly take credit for his or her success- but they view the average working latino as a either a threat to be dealt with or a potential voter to fool into switching to their side”
Although I have a problem with many aspects of this site and this particular writer due to his simplicity and superior than though perception of himself I think what you said above is inaccurate. Unless you have proof of course then I will believe you and support you 100%! You’re in a circling-the-tree way putting down Latinos who have taken the time to also work hard and achieve advanced educations. Be fair and let’s support those too that can possibly rise and be great leaders. Is there some associated with this site that are fame seekers and could careless about the plight of Latinos well yes look at the many people writing against Ruben Navarrette. We are not so easily fooled, we can see his elitist attitude a mile away but he throws in spanglish every once in while to claim his browness lmao. I’d like to believe there are a few in the bunch associated with this site who have it together and really care about our communities.
Time will tell and let’s see if this site promotes the latter as much as they do Navarrette!
Although I have a problem with many aspects of this site and this particular writer due to his simplicity and superior than though perception of himself I think what you said above is inaccurate. Unless you have proof of course then I will believe you and support you 100%! You’re in a circling-the-tree way putting down Latinos who have taken the time to also work hard and achieve advanced educations
Miguel-
first let me establish my bona fides
i spent over 30 years working at a nursery in a fairly well to do suburb an hour west of boston- right where the marathob starts- i started out pulling weeds at sub-minumum agricultural wages, no time and half, no benefits whatsoever, but plenty of hours available during the busy seasons i worked elbow to elbow with seasonal migrant contract workers from puerto rico and mexico, as well as local help from puerto rico, santo domingo,guatemala, and el salvador
the contract laborers lived in a bunkhouse during the duration of the contract, which ran from late march to mid november- 15 sets of bunkbeads in a wooden building that was up on stilts- not the ritz carlton, but really quite comfortable
when i was in my early to mid twenties i spent a lot of my free time there-i ate many a plate of rice and beans (which i still consider comfort food), spent many a night when there was an empty bunk, played a lot of dominos, and tried to sing along to the plenas and other traditional songs they sang in the evenings
there were chickens running around, a vegetable garden, makeshift hammocks, etc.
i loved it- i found them to be, for the most part, warm, generous, and funny men with a collective zest for life that is unfortunately too rarely encountered in the white society from which i originated
i did well in spanish in the 7th and 8th grade, and picked up a puerto rican dialect and vocabulary that to this day leaves native latins doubting my veracity when i tell them i have no latin blood or upbringing- for example, i visited costa rica in 2008 and while shopping in la fortuna in the arenal region, nearly every tico i interacted with asked me if i was from cuba,
but i digress: here is an example of the double standard the latin population is up against every minute of every day: fast forward 25 years or so- at this time i was in wholesale sales and was driving around the nursery one day looking for plants with one of my customers, a landscape designer from Weston, Massachusetts, one of the wealthiest towns in the country. this was to be her last job before she left for new mexico to help build houses for the navaho
she did not really have to work to keep a roof over her head : she married a well paid business executive and raised a family as a stay at home mom- when all the kids went of to make their way in the world, she attended a landscape design certificate program, then started her own business
during our travels that day, i came across the harvesting manager, one of the same people who i had gotten to know when we were both laborers back in our younger days- i needed to hash out some order fulfilment priorities with himand we discussed our business in spanish for about 15 minutes
as i drove away, she turned to me and said: “I didn’t know you were BI-lingual” as though it were nothing short of a miracle that i spoke any spanish at all- in that moment i realized that without knowing it herself, she practiced a double standard, because you and i both know that any latino she spoke with who spoke english well, but with an accent, would not have been afforded the same reaction of pleasant surprise and astonishment she directed at me that day
another example: 5 years ago, after parting company with the nursery, i found a new job and needed to show my prospective employer my social security card- since i have not needed the card itself for over 30 years, i walked into my local SS office and told the clerk i needed to replace my card- she asked me my name and card number and without batting an eye filled out a temporary card and told me i would be getting a new one in a week or so- i did not have to show any ID whatsoever- i invite anybody who is not tall, white, and friendly to try that and get back to me- “little brown people” don’t get that kind of treatment
another example: post 9/11 at the same bunkhouse i referred to earlier, 2 generations removed from the time i frequented the place on a regular basis: a six-month undercover police investigation produced 4 arrest warrants for relatively small scale cocaine and marijuana distribution (26 of the people there had nothing to do with it)- there are 7 doors in the bunkhouse- police procedure calls for 3 specially trained officers at each door, plus a 3 man back-up team for each door, for a total of 42 front line officers plus their command team and 2 helicopters- i don’t know if they made it a point to have any translators on hand- but everybody was forced to the floor face down and handcuffed before the place was searched- the foor guys they had warrants for were arrested as planned, and a fifth man was also arrested: Hector de Jesus, an evangelical puerto rican who did not do drugs (i know this for a fact because we discussed his religiosity, and i witnessed him refusing a puff on a joint while politely explaining that he did not do drugs, but did have an occasional beer and/or cigarette
Hector’s offense was having the misfortune to have his bunkbead located next to a wastebasket where someone had tossed a small bag of cocaine when the raid began- when i heard about what happened the next morning, i went to the local police station and spoke to the chief about securing Hector’s release- had he not already been arraigned, i would have succeeded- i don’t know how it all ended,and the district attorney’s office did not return my call- but this raid took place near the end of the contract, and Hector went back to puerto rico when he was supposed to- if he was unable or unwilling to return to massachusetts for the expectwed court appearances, a humble, hard-working, law abiding man is now a fugitive- and don’t think for a minute that a white judge won’t think of him in those terms, but as just another spick who is guilty as hell and trying to get himself off the hook with a sob story
here’s another one: what i went through with Jose Castaneda, (don jose)a mexican H2a worker whom we first employed in 1989 as a pesticide application supervisor. we paid him nearly twice as much as the laborers and he had as many hours available to him as he wanted- he was a very nice man who took a no-nonsense attitude toward his work, and made sure his crew did not slack off- since he had heard the nursery was winding down its field operations and was selling the land, he asked me to take him to the local social security office, which i did without asking him why- it turned out that he had reached the age of 62 and wanted to apply for his limited social security benefits- a bit more than $400 a month- we went through the application process- the clerk was a young white guy with no spanish, so i translated- there was a latina working nearby who chimed in now and then if i got stuck at the end of the application process, the clerk asked don jose for his ID- jose slid a VALID mexican passport complete with a VALID us visa- the clerk examined it and asked “where’s his I-94″ i asked him what that was and he told me it was a either small paper receipt or a stamp in his passport showing he was in the country legally- i asked jose why he didn’t have his and with a wave of his hand he said “where i cross, they just wave us through and say “pasanle”- now i know jose, who owns 4 houses in baja california, has a daughter who is a legal resident of the USin the LA area, and personally i could care less where he spends his winters- i googled up a DOT site that had border crossing statistics- at the san ysidro crossing, 12 million people a year walk into california from mexico- in a 16 hour day, that is one person every 2.6 seconds – so yes, “pasanle” is the order of the day- armed with this information, i made a few calls and found out Jose needed a “deferred inspection”, available only at international entry points, which, in our case was logan airport in boston- so we went there and explained the situation to a nice black lady in a blue uniform and packing a 9mm pistol- she handed me a pad of plain paper and a pen and told me to write down who i was, who jose was, and why we were here- when i was done, i handed her the pad, expecting Jose to get his I94 in that moment- it didn’t happen- she had to fax it to headquarters downtown and it usually took 48 hours, but since it was thursday afternoon it might take until tuesday, and they would call- i waited until wednesday, and when a woman familiar with the case answered the phone, she told me that my petition had been denied- i little more research revealed that i was now the petitioner of record for jose, and that i was now the only person who could file the SINGLE APPEAL he was allowed- a little more phone work put me in touch with an ICE employee of mexican origin in san diego- she too wore a blue uniform and carried a 9mm- she listened patiently while i told my story before suggesting that i simply take Jose out of the country and have him get his I94 on his way back in- her supervisor concurred- easy for them to say this, and i thought about putting jose on a greyhound bus to montreal, but decided to take him to canada myself (after checking to see if a mexican national needs a visa to enter canada, which they don’t)- six hours later we were at the canadian border and when the very cute french canadian border guard asked me where his I94 was, i told her nicely that i didn’t think it was her job to enforce US immigration laws- she replied that they might not let him back in- she then took his passport, my passport, and Jose into the canadian building and told me to make a u-turn- i picked him up on the other side, along with our passports and a letter stating it was okay for Jose to leave canada- we walked into the US building, and there was a portait of bush, and one of cheney, and way more people with blue uniforms and 9mm pistols than they could possibly ever need- i had the awful feeling that we had just walked into the middle of a twilight zone episode- then a little brown man with a name tag “castillo” walked over to us and i figured we were in like flint- turns out castillo was from trinidad and spoke very little spanish, but had spent time at the mexican border crossing (as all ICE folks are required to do) so he knew our story rang true- he interviewed us at length, looked us up on the computer and then came over to us asking me if jose had gotten any sort of receipt with his visa- i told him i didn’t know, but i had instructed Jose to bring every scrap of paper relative to his journey even if it was a reciept for a pack of gum at the bus station in arizona, and it was all in an envelope in my truck- castillo said to me “you wait here”, and he and jose went outside- they came back about 15 minutes later, castillo walking with a little swagger before he said “yeah- he had a 797 in the truck, so he’s all set”- he gave jose the needed I94, so now i would not be responsible for him having to eat catfood as his reward for doing agricultural work for the USA since the age of 11- we got back in the truck, which was pointed south, and i asked him if he was still going to buy me the canadian lunch that was the subterfuge we dreamed up for going to canada in the first place- he said “your damn right”- so we entered canada, had a nice lunch, and then headed home, but not without some puzzled looks at the US station when we recrossed into the states
so Miguel- i know whereof i speak
I didn’t say these situations exist I was disputing your claim that everyone 100% who is associated to this site doesn’t care about Latinos as you suggested. This part of your argument: “do not be fooled into thinking that the people behind this web site are not biased against the average latino- they will showcase the very few high achieving conservative latinos who have chosen a career in public service, and proudly take credit for his or her success- but they view the average working latino as a either a threat to be dealt with or a potential voter to fool into switching to their side”
This is the issue I had because I don’t think that is accurate or 100% true. I’m really hoping this site can redeem itself and start showcasing real Latino leaders and not people like Ruben Navarrette
the point i am trying to make is that the political ideology and policies of the right wing of the GOP, newt gingrich among the foremost of them, are geared toward the “haves”, and the “have mores”, and NOT intended to favor the people on the lower rungs of the economic ladder
picture people standing on a ladder that represents wealth, with the rich on top of the ladder and the poor on the bottom
some people will reach down and help pull people up
some will politely move aside when someone is getting ahead of them
some will step on the fingers of those below
and others will reach down and saw the rungs off
i number the current GOP leaders in the last group- witness the tax bill they are jamming down obama’s throat right now
they claim that deregulation and lower taxes on the rich will result in better jobs for everyone, even the least among us
so how’s that working out for everybody?- we followed that policy under bush, and obama inherited the worst economy since the great depression- yet the GOP still clings to their mantra
the last time the gap between rich and poor was as wide as it is now was right before the great depression
30 years ago, the typical CEO of a company made about 14 times the annual wages is its average worker- right now, that multiple stands at around 435 times
we are headed toward an oligarchy, if we haven’t already gotten there- “the rich get richer and the poor get poorer”- the playing field is tilted- progressive tax policies help even it out
there is nothing wrong with folks with a lot of money paying higher tax rates than those with less
the poor will always be with us, but there is nothing wrong with writing legislation that favors those who struggle every day to keep food on the table and a roof over their heads- the “red meat right” seems to assume that if you don’t make enough money, it is a moral failing on your part
that is not reality- you are dealing with a bunch of smug, conniving con artists
Guarijo Dichoso; Being most respectful of your experiences of friendship with your Hispanic fellow laborers, it is only fair and right to extend a great deal of gratitude to your good nature and compassion. The double standard you present that portrays your acquaintances as victims is likely true in many places across the country. However, such experiences cannot be accepted as the standard of living for all Hispanics, nor for all illegal immigrants. We all have our stories and experiences with respect to an individual we know who remains in the U.S. illegally. We all know and/or have worked directly with an illegal immigrant. Particularly those of us who work in the construction, farming, factory or service industry. We all have a neighbor or two (or several) who reside in the States illegally. Our kids go to school with kids who are here illegally. That is not to say that all suffer the same plight that you have presented. Are these incidents heartbreaking? Sure they are. But there are many illegals who have done very well for themselves at the expense of their own fellow countrymen. Many have used their own national patriotism to take advantage of people of their own ethnicity. Regardless of Party affiliation, regardless of their own skin color, Liberal-Progressives and Moderate-Centrist alike find it very opportunistic to take advantage of these future victims by luring them with a promised land preaching, then abandoning them when they’ve secured and used their support. The hard luck and victimology that you bring to light is not by the doing of an overwhelming majority of Americans, nor by the immigration policies that now exist. Quite the contrary, the victimization comes in large part at the hands of the employer who knowingly or unknowingly employ these people knowing full well that the wages they set are substandard and a form of slave driving. And they do it, because they know they can. So much for “Si se puede”.
Your lengthy point is made and well taken but it won’t bear out. Victimization works both ways. As more and more illegals settle into a given community and find great comfort in their own overwhelming numbers, boldness sets in and their culture becomes one that we are expected to embrace and assimilate to. With the aid and full support of Left leaning politicos (many Republicans included), the uninvited guest begins to set the rules and standards for the those who have been forced to be the host. Too many of those reluctant hosts are Americans of Hispanic descent. By the mere fact that I am a Latino born in America, I am look down upon with disdain and disrespect by too many of the same people that you claim to lend your compassion. I have been victimized by the illegal immigrant who has found sanctuary in the displaced compassion of well intentioned people like yourself. Not much different than those who are not so well intentioned as you. I live and work in the same kind of community that you describe, and I cannot allow my own quality of life experiences to be diminished by yours. So, El Guajiro Dichoso, I too, know all too well of what I speak.
Though your story can deliver a compelling bite, you would have to admit, your one sided double standard works both ways. Patience and perseverance are virtuous. Standing in line waiting to achieve legal status in America is long, tedious and very hard to accomplish. Coming across the border and remaining here illegally cheapens the beautiful gift of gaining American citizenship. If you want to offer real compassion, encourage your friends to do what is right.
i should clarify that those guys were here legally
they were paid the federally established prevailing agricultural wage, which could vary from year to year- some years it was too high in the opinion of the owners, and they opted for local help
and i am not talking about intentional victimization- i am of the opinion that many times their humanity was discounted because of language, culture, and color barriers on the part of otherwise well-meaning people
i did once advocate for 3 guys that had been with us for over 5 years when we found out they were illegal- i recommended that the nursery loan them the money to retain an immigration attorney, which they did- i wrote each guy a letter of reference- in about 3 years time, they all got green cards
only later did i find out that encouraging an illegal to stay in the country was a felony
the way the law is written, during the hiring process; “if it looks good, it is good”- to question the authenticity of someone’s social security card based on anything other than the appearance of the card itself is against the law because it could lead to discriminatory hiring practices
conversely, if someone’s documents are dubious looking, you are required to investigate- in one example, 2 brazilian guys came in together- one had good looking documents, but the other guy’s papers were bogus looking- we put them to work that morning, and the HR director looked into their papers- we let them both go that afternoon because they were both illegal- the fact that they came in together was good enough reason to check them both out
we did not knowingly hire illegals
and lest you think i am more of a bleeding heart liberal than i actually am, i think the 14th amendment should be changed to the extent that only the children born to legal immigrants can enjoy immediate citizenship- if a pregnant woman wades across the rio grand to pop out a kid, i see no reason, except the current law, to consider that child a citizen of the US
and you are right about being dissed by non-citizens – we had some guys who were born in new york and grew up in hells kitchen- they could not speak english very well, nor could they speak spanish well- perhaps if they had some sort of work ethic, it would not have matttered so much how they spoke
in the 1800s in boston, the local yankees were scared to death of being taken over by the irish immigrants- that is exactly what happened- the irish took over city government and held on for a long time
today the mayor is of italian extraction, and it doesn’t bother anyone i know one bit
i forgot to add that if the is a god, castillo had that 797 in his pocket when he and Jose went to my truck
at one point, they were ready to take him into custody- i overheard a conversation between castillo and a guy in a regular army camo uniform- with castillo telling him his services would not be needed
when castillo was around, i asked anothe officer if she saw cases like ours very often- she said there was similar situation a couple of weeks ago- it didn’t end well
I don’t like and I don’t approve in any way illegal immigration, but I know that behind it lies the irresponsibility of decades of doing nothing about it. I grant reason to Mr. Gringich: it’s not possible to deport more than 11 million people, 8.5 millions from Latin-America plus 3 millions from other countries, including Europe. Now the fact is the need to solve this great complication that involves an enormous crowd of persons. This scenario makes, in my opinion, not viable the massive deportation. This solution would bring an unaffordable cost and many political and social complications. Countries of origin receive great money remittances and other positive benefits for them. All these huge illegal immigration came fleeing of misery, political persecution and, also in a certain percent, looking for a profitable ground for crime. This is possible because borders were not safe and the persistent efforts of human traffickers; but still there is another cause: they provide huge benefits to employers, house landlords and exploiters in the underground business of vices.
Let’s now see the problem from another angle. Sometimes a part of the benefits for origin’s countries are evil in nature. Immigration has become a variant of the Troy’s horse. In the same way that de immigration from Cuba allowed the Castro’s Government to infiltrate hundreds, maybe thousands, of agents and spies, others are using this situation for their own purposes. Drug cartels, criminal organizations abroad, and even foe countries, or those not so friendly ones, are doing the same. I’m sure that the intelligence community of this country knows exactly about these phenomena.
Part of the immigration comes to build a new life. Other part doesn’t: they come to expand their criminal way of life or to destroy this nation. This is showed up every day; just notice the bombing attempts in NY’s Times Square, Portland and Baltimore. Certain sectors agitated much for a ‘comprehensive’ immigration reform, but amnesty is not a solution. The key is to find ways to identify the evil components, to send them back to their countries and proceed to design and apply a process with conditions for the rest.
The selective and orderly immigration gives definite benefits. Hard workers, smart and with a good future, are an asset to the nation. The solution will cost much work and deal with difficult moments. To ignore the problem only will complicate it. Politicians and political parties must understand this; if they don’t, then it will be a disaster for this great nation. I think that, after the defense and economy, this is the most important issue. Without security, economical strength and interior order it won’t be possible to have education, health and culture. I pray God grant our leaders wisdom to decide with righteousness.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Wetback
Who says we can’t deport millions of illegal immigrants?
Okay ChuckR; I’ll go out on a limb. The editable Wiki version of history is taken into consideration (reluctantly). But in your lengthy quip, it’s difficult to understand your tone. A sense of dignity in this discussion is a priority. I hope you’re not the type who enjoys seeing a derogatory term thrown around.
it just isn’t practical to round that many people up and put them on a bus
what we need is a workable program that allows potential employers to get the workers they need, particularly in agriculture
to stem the hiring of undocumented workers, we need something better than the current social security card which is so easy to forge
a high tech national ID card might work, but there would be a lot of resistance to it from many quarters
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